Ryan Millsap Talks With Steak Shapiro of Atlanta Eats

Ryan Millsap, Chairman & CEO of Atlanta-based Blackhall Studios, is one of today’s top entertainment executives! With a vision for Blackhall that’s ambitious, energizing, and boundless, Millsap is blazing a trail through the heart of the South – and setting his sights on the future of entertainment. Listen and learn as Ryan Millsap journeys through the myriad industries, people, and landscapes that traverse the complex and dynamic world of film production.

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Ryan: Welcome to the Blackhall Studios Podcast. We here at the podcast are just as happy as you are that 2020 is in the rearview mirror. The studio was a ghost town for six months, and I'm happy to say we're filming multiple projects now. Along the way, we had to re-engineer our entire HVAC system to provide for the safety of our movie crews. Yeah, I'm looking forward to 2021 bringing us all a little more prosperity. We begin our second year of this podcast, and I'm as excited today as I was in the beginning. Thank you for listening in, and know that we definitely appreciate you being here with us.

Three decades ago, Boston sports talk radio host Eddie Andelman gave a 20-year-old intern the name ‘Steak’ after sampling a particularly fine one at a local steakhouse that he liked. The name stuck, and it works, given Steak’s love for vittles. Shapiro is a larger-than-life Atlanta local and national personality, with shows on the Food Network, like Food Truck Face-Off and Best Ever. And he's, of course, famous in Atlanta for his show Atlanta Eats.

He's a frequent contributor to CNN, Fox News, Fox Business, and MSNBC. Changing his gigs has never been a problem, and Steak has never shied away from new creations. With two top-rated media companies under his belt, Shapiro's an extrovert with the heart of an entrepreneur. Ladies and gentlemen, Steak Shapiro.

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Ryan: Hi, this is Ryan Millsap. Welcome to the Blackhall Studios podcast. Today on the podcast, we have Steak Shapiro, an Atlanta legend. Steak, welcome to the program.

Steak: How are you doing, brother?

Ryan: I'm doing fantastic.

Steak: So good to see you.

Ryan: You too. So, what restaurants survived this pandemic?

Steak: What restaurants survived? Well, a lot of restaurants. So, here's the story with restaurants: it's no different from regular business, if you had a preexisting condition. So, the economy in Atlanta is just on fire, pre-COVID. Right? An all-time unemployment numbers low; restaurants are crushing; all my buddies in hotel restaurant hospitality were doing record numbers in ’19 – and even mediocre restaurants, because you're out so much, and people were so liquid. They were doing okay, even though you're like, “Eh, it's okay. But we can’t eat at the same place every night.”

So, COVID hits, and if you had a preexisting condition – you had lousy bartenders, or your food was mediocre, or you just didn't run a tight ship – you're probably in trouble. You probably have a chance to be out of business, just like some dude with diabetes who’s 200 pounds overweight is probably screwed, right? And I mean that not to be callous. So, it weeded out mediocrity. It sucks for a lot of locals. And by the way – there's plenty of great restaurants that are suffering as well.

But, for the most part, if you ran a great restaurant; if you're a great restaurant group; if you had a great following; if you're in a neighborhood that supported you; if you're a bigger restaurant brand; you pivoted to takeout and carry out... I mean, there's pain points. Can we say ‘shitty’ on this thing?

Ryan: You can say anything you want.

Steak: So, if you're a shitty restaurant, or a mediocre restaurant, bye-bye. It's probably over. And that's part of weeding out who ran their business well and who didn't – just like now. Who was smart about the new world we live in? Restaurants are no different. And it's fascinating to see what restaurants did, really, in terms of trying to get back to alcohol sales – sending people home with bottles of wine, making beautiful margaritas, standing out in the corner; pivoting.

Restauranteurs are grinders, right? If you want to be super-successful; if you want to be rich – you start a hedge fund, or you do what you do. You build these nice studios. Right? “I want to be in the restaurant business. I want to make millions of dollars.” No.

Ryan: Not unless it’s Chick-fil-A.

Steak: Well, yeah – and they didn't start there, thinking that way, right? So, guys and women – that's why we love telling stories about restaurants. Because everybody's got a story, right?

Ryan: Well, you know what they say about most restaurants. It's like owning a racehorse, or owning a boat. The best way to become rich owning a restaurant is to start out super-rich. Because you're going to lose a lot of money.

Steak: Or just... I don't know if ‘nine out of ten restaurants fail’ is bullshit or not, but it's a grind, man. And the problem is, most guys aren’t business guys who start restaurants, right? They're just chefs. Or someone's been telling them for years, “You’ve got this great recipe,” or they just have these romantic visions. And then you start dealing with labor, and food costs, and customers, and people who come in hammered – so-and-so's banging the chef, and the GM. And, I mean, it's a frigging nightmare.

Ryan: I think all those all those vices are repeated over and over in every restaurant.

Steak: Well, look, it's changed. I wasn't in the business. I'm just a good eater. I got on the Food Network. I was the only guy on the Food Network that had never been a chef. So it was, “How did you end up there?” I was like, “I'm a really good diner. I dine well.”

Ryan: How do you eat as much as you do and stay skinny?

Steak: Well, I don't know about skinny – but smaller portions. I punish myself. If you see me on Instagram, when I eat pasta, I say that my Jewish guilt takes over. “I've had too many carbs this week. I’ve gotta go run around Chastain Park five times.” Except I make it, like, once.

Ryan: You don't do it like wine tasting, where you eat the pasta, swish it around your mouth, and spit it out?

Steak: Haha. I know a guy – David Pollack, who is a big ESPN...

Ryan: He played at Georgia, right?

Steak: He played at Georgia. He's a college football analyst. He worked for me in radio. His first media job, he worked for me at the station I owned, 790 The Zone. And the guy's in impeccable shape. He used to be pudgy, kind of, when he played in high school and college. And then he got on TV. He's ‘TV thin,’ right? This crazy son of a bitch literally used to take a bite of chocolate or pasta – just wanted the flavors in his mouth – and then he would spit it out.

Ryan: That sounds like a New York model.

Steak: Right? Well, you would know. You would know, my friend. I don't. Are we talking about the fact that you’re...

Ryan: Yeah. I'm getting engaged. I'm getting married in May.

Steak: Wow. You are just a romantic, right? I've been looking at your photo shoots lately. I mean, this guy is a Renaissance man. That town and country photo shoot? You have a bathtub outside at your country estate? Is that what's going on?

Ryan: I did. I put two bathtubs out in the field.

Steak: Jeez. That's what you know it's new love, right? When you're naked in a bathtub out in a farm. Right?

Ryan: It’s like Eden.

Steak: But you're happy, right?

Ryan: I'm so happy.

Steak: You look so chill.

Ryan: I know. Well, she's absolutely amazing. Now, she's very, very lucky, because she has an incredibly good metabolism, because she eats whatever she wants.

Steak: Seriously? And she drinks whatever she wants?

Ryan: It's not fair.

Steak: That’s, like, the perfect woman. You can eat with her without the downside.

Ryan: Well, she makes most of the food. She's an incredible chef.

Steak: Dude. I see her. Should we give a plug to her Instagram account? Have we done that before?

Ryan: Yeah.

Steak: “VibeWithBritt?” Is that it?

Ryan: “VibeWithBritt.” You're right. @VibeWithBritt.

Steak: She's making these ridiculously awesome meals. Like, curating. And then she's out in her bathtub, and she’s got her feet up, and she's got the wine. And I'm sitting here with my three freaking kids doing carpool, just trying to survive the goddamn pandemic. And this son of a bitch is sitting out there in a frigging bathtub with a model, and it's like, “What the fuck is going on here?”

Ryan: Well, it's hard for extroverts to understand how wonderful all of this pandemic has been in many ways for the introverts. I mean, we just retreat to a farm and run baths and read books.

Steak: You’d be surprised. People say, like, “Well, you're on the radio; you're on TV. You’ve got to be missing people.” I can do me, like, five straight days of Netflix and cooking at home and being with the kids. And when it gets... Georgia doesn't have a lot of it. But when it gets rainy and cold and a little snowy, that's just awesome. Light the fire; all nuzzle up together. There's nothing better than a house full of kids and a dog. Right?

And I know; I see your girls out there. But I’m pretty sure you feel the same way. When it's your own little team, and it's like, “We're locked down today, baby. Here's the menu. We're having chili for lunch. We’ll probably make a big ol’ roast for dinner,” right? My daughter's in the baking business – my 13-year-old. So, she's going to start making cookies. And then Dad starts to figure out, “What can we watch all together – a 9, 13, and 15 year old?” So, I'm all about not going anywhere.

Ryan: It's the modern equivalent of ‘40 acres and a mule.’

Steak: Right.

Ryan: It's just you and the fam out there trying to survive; to make something for yourself in America.

Steak: Yeah. Some people have better places to survive than others – wink, wink, buddy, over there. But I am very happy for you, and happy to be here at Blackhall, where things are rocking and rolling.

Ryan: We're rocking and rolling.

Steak: So, you're testing all the time? People, when they come to go on set... what are the rules of making movies, and all that stuff?

Ryan: Well, I don't run all that. That's run by the Producers Guild. And they've done an incredible job. They spent basically all of the lockdown working with the other unions – the Screen Actors Guild, the Directors Guild, IATSE, the Teamsters. And they had to come up with a protocol that all of those other unions would sign off on.

Steak: So, when I'm watching now – finally, now, coming out, if I'm watching TV or watching movies – they’re referring to the pandemic. There are episodes, like on episodic TV, where there are pandemic episodes. So, they really started about... what, five months ago, being able to get people in a sound studio, or on a soundstage, or whatever it is?

Ryan: Yeah. Really, September 1st is when things were ripping again. People started dabbling in August. Then, in September, the fuse was lit.

Steak: So, I know about folks in hospitality. What was it like in LA for all those people? And Atlanta? What did everybody do for those five months?

Ryan: Nothing.

Steak: How much despair was there in the industry through all that?

Ryan: I think, in a similar way to what we saw all across the economic spectrum in the US... For people that lived in economic strata where they had cash, and where they weren't worried about their next meal or their house or whatever – those three months were kind of like a vacation.

Steak: No doubt. But listen – for a lot of folks... I will just say this. I'm not going to get political at all, but I’ve got buddies. My wife is from Lafayette. They’re as red as it gets. Lafayette, Louisiana. “Get your gun. Get ready to go, baby.” My mom and my dad are from Brookline, Massachusetts. If there's a more liberal place... maybe Haight-Ashbury, or something. I mean, I’ve heard both ends of it, right?

But I will say that it's not hard for New Yorkers with a lot of money, or people up in Boston, to say, “Oh, everybody shut down; everybody stay in.” Well, yeah. Because you're not affected at all.

Ryan: You're in the Hamptons for three months.

Steak: Exactly. You know, me and my buddies pivoted to the Hamptons for nine months. But then there's people on the ground floor trying to make a living – like production assistants; like grip guys; guys like that. Right?

Ryan: Well, what I will say is, I was going to talk about this industry. This industry has been ripping for years now. In the post-Netflix era of entertainment, if you are trained in entertainment, you can work as much as you want. So, the industry has been starved for talent. But if you've been working in the industry, you've been working as much as you want, and you get paid great wages. It's all union wages; union scale. So, if you swing a hammer and you're building houses, you make 40, 50 grand a year. If you swing a hammer and you're building sets, you make 120 grand a year.

Steak: Wow. So, people just had to take a deep breath and wait for it all to come back – which it is.

Ryan: Exactly. And I think everybody... again, most people took the first 90 days and believed it was going to be over. And so, it was this extended kind of moment of spiritual reflection. And then, it didn't end, and people started to freak out. By 60 days of it not ending, everybody was like, “We’ve got to get back to work.”

Steak: “We’ve got to figure this out.”

Ryan: Thankfully, there were producers who were working on all these protocols the whole time. When the time finally came, they said, “Is Georgia open? We're going to make films.” I mean, that's basically what they said. They said, “We can't hang out in New York. We can't hang out in LA. Kemp's kept Georgia open. We love it. We’re there.”

Steak: And there’s no indication that Georgia opening has spiked, in terms of... because your sets... I mean, you don't know all the details, but they're testing frequently. It's like NBA teams. It's like sports.

Ryan: It’s twice a week.

Steak: Yeah. I mean, I’m not telling you there aren’t positives.

Ryan: It's very low, though. The entertainment industry – one of the reasons why it's also been able to... you know, it convinced California to make it an essential business. You probably read those articles about restaurants being closed, and across the street...

Steak: Their hands are up in the air. “What the ‘F’ is going on here?”

Ryan: “Why are they... oh, there's a guy right across the street barbecuing, feeding the film crew.”

Steak: “The craft tables are open, and they're feeding them. Why can't I be open?”

Ryan: But part of the reason was, is that the film industry has now established, by tracking all the data, that their transmission rate is under 1%. 1% is incredibly low in any industry, but for an industry where people are so close together in small spaces, to be able to keep that transmission rate so low has been really impressive.

Steak: Listen. I got buddies up in New York and Boston, and some in LA. I was like, “My kids are in school since September. My daughter had a full volleyball season. I went to every game with a mask in the stands – just the parents. That was great. They had maybe a couple of days where there was not one kid – like, maybe six positives, and they shut down, and a little bit of a spike.” But I tell my daughter, driving her to school: “You're the 99%. You're the one-percenter. You're in school full-time; you're playing your sports. Your season started and ended on time, right? Your life, compared to... look around the rest of the country. Georgia has been pretty lucky.”

Ryan: Well, my kids are in California; in LA. And so, they haven't been in school for a year. And volleyball's been kind of hit or miss. They live on the LA County / Orange County border. So everything south, that's Orange County – open. Everything that's north, LA County – closed.

Steak: So, what do you think the residual effect of kids not going to school in person has been for them, and kids in general?

Ryan: I think they hate it. And I think it's really negative. Particularly... my oldest is 16, so she missed half of her freshman year and half of her sophomore year doing school from home. I think, though, this is going to be a generation similar to the generation of kids who grew up in the Depression, where food was so scarce, and the rest of their lives, they were very thoughtful about food. Right? Either very grateful, or very resourceful, or whatever. But food was a big deal in their psychology.

I think this generation of kids... I think all of the opportunities to do things together in big groups, and party – whether it's little things like going to the theater, or big things like going to concerts, they're going to see those as luxury items the rest of their life, I think. And I think you're going to see those industries boom.

Steak: Well, they’re already more thoughtful. I mean, this is a group much more thoughtful and purpose-driven, too – of, “What can we do to contribute, in whatever way it is?” So, the stuff I know – the stuff you hear about what's important, maybe more to 20-year-olds, wasn't the shit that I was thinking about when I was in my 20s. So, there's a thoughtfulness.

Ryan: Well, you were in your 20s when Michael Douglas was saying ‘greed is good’ on Wall Street.

Steak: Yeah, I don't know. Maybe a little younger than that at that time. But yeah; something like that. It was also an era where, like, “What's the purpose of this company? What's the CEO's values? What's this?” Who gave a shit about that? Like, dude, I just wanted to make enough money to be able to go with my buddies on the weekends. And maybe I'll be at this gig for a while. I mean, I was in entertainment. But we didn't think that way. Now, you’d better have a clear delineation of what your company stands for. Which I think is a good thing, probably. Folks are more focused on that.

Ryan: I think it's good and bad. I'm a big proponent of legislating freedom and educating choice. And some of this stuff feels pretty heavy-handed.

Steak: Cancel culture, for sure. Companies who now have to... I mean, their company’s done great work forever. And now... if you want to look deep into any actor, executive, CEO – I mean, if you want to go deep enough on anyone, you can find something. What I found amazing, even in the sports world... So, you draft a kid. He plays three years at... I don't know, North Carolina. Or sign him as a free agent. It's like, “Dude, did you see this post he had on Facebook when he was 12?” Like, no shit. When he was 12.

Ryan: Thank God you didn't have Facebook when you were 12.

Steak: God, the debauchery of my life growing up. But I'm saying, like, okay. Now, even if you're reading something super unpleasant or harsh, why do we assume that a 12-year-old didn’t all of a sudden see the light and be like, “That was a really fucked up way of looking at the world.” But they'll go back. I mean, maybe you won't go to ten. I would say that the cutoff for something that you could say is 12 or 13, where it could affect you in your 20s. Do you see that?

Ryan: I think in this culture, if you had Facebook posts when you were seven that were... I mean, I don't know what seven-year-old has freaky Facebook. But if you did – if you were really racist when you were seven? I think that would come back and haunt you in today's culture. There's not a lot of space for the psychological evolution of a child – adolescence into adulthood – if everything in your life is documented, like recorded history.

Steak: That's the whole thing. You can go back and try to find something. Now, in some cases – listen. For some crazy bastards, you go back, and you realize, “Oh, you could see that starting to develop at 12 or 13.” But, my God. How about the ability for people to mature and learn and educate themselves, so the same shit they thought when they were playing high school baseball isn't how they think now?

Ryan: 90% of people aren't...

Steak: One would hope, unless you're exposed to awful stuff. But anyway – it's great that you guys are open for business, and making great films, right?

Ryan: We're so thankful. And the industry has exploded. Certainly, the impact of streaming is gargantuan. If you look back pre-Netflix making House of Cards, the industry was doing about 40 billion a year of content. And let's take 2020 out, because I don't think any of those numbers have come out, and I don't know what they'll look like. But 2019 was over 80 billion.

Steak: It’s gotta be. I mean, and they’re just adding more and more. So, we have three shows that are in development; development deals that we have. And we're just going right down the gamut – Hulu, Netflix, Amazon, Disney Plus. Now there's HBO Max. There are food shows. So I'm in the food and sports space. We're working on something with Big Boi from OutKast called Big Boi’s Gotta Eat.

Ryan: That's a great title.

Steak: Yeah, it's a good title. He's way into seafood. And he doesn't eat meat. He grew up in Charleston. This big black guy, who's one of the great rappers of all time, from one of the great hip hop groups – he's way into food. He got deeper into it in the pandemic.

Ryan: Does he own one of those restaurants?

Steak: He doesn’t. He does not own one. But he's never been asked to do a food show. So, we're like, “What do they tell you out in LA? It's all about the EP, right? Who's the guy that's going to attach himself to the project?” So, we're going to travel to Charleston, and to New Orleans, and to anywhere there's fresh seafood, and it's kind of a combination of Dirty Jobs meets Diners, Drive-Ins, and Dives. He's going to do the job – crabbing, oystering, or whatever it is. So, it’s kind of a fish out of water thing – this black guy, living in Atlanta, who's a huge music artist, is now getting into that. And then he will cook the food after.

We developed the deal during the pandemic – because guess what? Big Boi was available for Zoom calls, because he's like, “I ain't doing shit right now. I'll talk about a food show.” Same thing with a couple of other guys working on. But anyway, my point is, we got him to sign this deal. And now, it's not like we have only one place it could land. Like, Food Network. “Do you know anybody at the Food Network?” “Shit, I don't know. You’ve got, like, 12 different places that’ll probably hit you up after this.” But the reality is, there's so many, and they're all in a race for content, right? It's this beautiful race.

Ryan: There’s not enough to watch.

Steak: And they're all competing. Look how HBO Max has come on. I was trying to think about what I wanted to watch. I think Denzel's got a movie that launched on Max, right? And then, I think they got that show The Flight Attendant. Have you seen that, or heard about it? It’s supposed to be great, but you’ve got to get HBO Max. I was like, “Oh, let me add another one.”

Ryan: I have all of them.

Steak: You have all of them. Right. Well, you have to. You probably filmed half of them, friggin’ across the street here. So, we're doing a deal with that. But during the pandemic, our mindset... We were on a content studio. We started with Atlanta Eats, and now we're doing all this national stuff.

It's like, “Just assume that everybody is reachable, and at home.” It almost leveled the playing field. No matter how famous, or how rich, or how much you are out of touch with it. Your ass is at home, and your ass is watching... what was it at first? Tiger King was the first one, right?

Ryan: The first pandemic blockbuster.

Steak: Right. So, everybody's doing the same shit. They're making food at home. They're hanging with their families. People have been touring for 15 years; 20 years; 25 years; film sets, for all these years. It's like, “Bro, you’ve got to find a home.”

Ryan: Unless you’re a billionaire, and then you are on a yacht.

Steak: But early on, there were only a few really obnoxious assholes taking pictures of themselves on yachts. Who was it – was it Katzenberg?

Ryan: No, it was not. It was the other one who was with Katzenberg at DreamWorks.

Steak: So, it's Spielberg. Katzenberg.

Ryan: The third one. The third one was the one.

Steak: Who was the third one? Somebody’s got to research that. We'll figure that out. So, he was the guy that was like, “The world's in an amazing pandemic.” And he put an Instagram photo up of this ridiculous view from his yacht.

Ryan: “Suffering” in the pandemic.

Steak: Yeah. Way to be in touch.

Ryan: “Social distancing.”

Steak: But, for the most part, it was... Us Weekly does that. “They're just like us.” And it's all a bunch of bullshit. Just because someone went to Whole Foods, and they didn't do their hair right. “Oh my God, look. It's Amy Adams, and she's at a park. It's amazing.” Like, okay, she's at a park when she's not traveling around the globe. But in this case...

Ryan: No, but there is some truth in that. In LA, all these girls have no makeup. They don't do their hair. They're in Lululemon, and LA parks look like Buckhead. It's just famous people.

Steak: And if you go to SoulCycle, you're going to see people.

Ryan: 100%.

Steak: You're right. Because that's the industry. Just like in Atlanta – I think you just had T.I. on. You know how many times I’ve run into T.I. at restaurants?

Ryan: All the time.

Steak: Yeah.

Ryan: That’s where David Geffen – how did we not come up with David Geffen's name?

Steak: David Geffen was the asshole on the on the yacht, right? Who's the guy that failed with the short little ‘under ten-minute films?’ Was that Katzenberg?

Ryan: No, that was Katzenberg. That was called Quibi.

Steak: Nice. So, now I can't get deals done with either one of those guys, because I’ve disparaged both of them. I was so close.

Ryan: Your only hope of the triumvirate of DreamWorks is Spielberg, so thank God you’ve still got him on speed dial.

Steak: I was going to say – I've got nothing bad to say about him. He’ll still take my calls. Said Steven Spielberg never. Right?

Ryan: One of my buddies is a very successful producer, and he got COVID. He’s actually in his mid-50s, and he was in a coma for 18 days.

Steak: Stop it.

Ryan: He's totally fine now. Totally fine. But it was early spring; early COVID. Induced coma; 18 days. Everybody thought he was going to die. He came out. He's like, “I didn't even know the difference. It was like a long nap. My family, obviously, had been freaking out.” But he goes, “The craziest part was, everyone in Hollywood who I've known over the years, that I haven't heard from in decades, all called me. All I had to do was almost die to get a call from Spielberg.”

Steak: He said, “Right, listen. I wish I’d gotten that call next week.”

Ryan: He was so thankful. But I thought it was a funny story.

Steak: So, did he have preexisting conditions?

Ryan: No. He's totally healthy.

Steak: Shit, I hate stories like that. So, have you had it?

Ryan: No. It’s a roulette wheel.

Steak: I'm 54. How old are you?

Ryan: 46.

Steak: Okay, so everybody looks at me. I'm gonna knock on wood. It's like, “Hold on a second, Steak. How the fuck do you not have it? You're in restaurants; your company's open.” I'm kind of around a lot, you know? I’ve got three kids. One of my kids got it. They're all in school. I'm not saying I'm an asshole. I wear a mask. I have no problem at all, so I don't make a political statement about, “I can't wear it.” Of course I'll wear a friggin’ mask.

Ryan: But now you're eating.

Steak: Listen, there are plenty of places where I’ll relax it. My point is, everybody around me has gotten it over the last two months. I knew, maybe... of good friends, 30 people in the first eight months. I know 50 people in the last five weeks. And 99% said it was like a cold. And I'm not making any statement other than that’s what I heard. But then I hear your one – that outlier. That scares the shit out of me.

Ryan: And that's why the world shut down. It's the outliers.

Steak: Yeah. I mean, there's a lot of people dying without preexisting conditions.

Ryan: Now, I'm not a doctor, but my guess would be that the flu, every year, has similar outliers where somebody who is healthy gets the flu and dies.

Steak: But not at these numbers. I mean, the numbers are getting into the 400-something. I don't know. Listen, I have doctors who will say... I literally have doctors. Good schools; both successful. I'll talk to one doctor, because I can say this. When my kid got COVID, who was nine. And forget about my kid. Here's what I talked to one doctor about.

He said, “Listen, it's the flu. It's not that much worse. We never should have shut down. It should have been herd immunity. You should have just let it happen.” I'll talk to another doctor who will be like, “This is so friggin’ serious. This is a fucking shit show. And you know what? We should be doing everything and then some, because people are dying. And don't you dare say it's like the flu, because the flu didn’t do... A, B and C.”

So, again, I lean towards being cautious. My mom's 82, as of yesterday. And she’s in unbelievable shape. Walks five miles a day. But she's like, “I'm not doing anything until somebody tells me to come out.” And then there are other 80-year-olds who are like, “I need to be with my family,” and they'll roll the dice. And they get it. I mean, you've heard of 80-year-olds, like... My dad was hospitalized for four days. He's totally fine. So I don't know what to believe. I try to be smart about it, but I feel like... we're in February. I'm just crossing my fingers. Let me get to the finish line here.

Ryan: Well, Georgia is open.

Steak: So, are you surprised that you haven't gotten it?

Ryan: No, I don't really even think about it.

Steak: Has anybody close to you gotten it?

Ryan: No. I mean, my buddy was really sick. But I didn't even know he was really sick, because he lives in LA. He told me this story six weeks after he's out of the hospital. I said, “You almost died six weeks ago? Like, what?” But how would we know? He's in a coma. He can't call me.

Steak: So, when you're sitting there in your bathtub, out in the middle of the farm, you're not thinking about COVID – because nobody’s near you?

Ryan: There’s nobody near me. It's the greatest.

Steak: So, here's the most important question – because we do want to be sensitive to other people. Are you gonna have a bachelor party? Is that insensitive?

Ryan: I mean, I have had at least 15 friends offer to throw me a bachelor party.

Steak: Can I be the 16th?

Ryan: I just can't imagine... We know way too much about life, and the world. The kind of bachelor parties we would throw today? We'd all get COVID and die.

Steak: So, the rule is... is this your second marriage?

Ryan: Second marriage.

Steak: And you’re in your 40s?

Ryan: Yeah. But it’s the first marriage for her. It's a big wedding. This’ll be a real...

Steak: Big, sexy, awesome, fun wedding.

Ryan: A beautiful wedding.

Steak: But I’m not talking about that. Let's go back to the bachelor side of things.

Ryan: Right. Bachelor side.

Steak: Did you have a bachelor party for your first wedding?

Ryan: Yeah.

Steak: Where'd you go?

Ryan: I was just in California. In LA. It was actually pretty...

Steak: It was one night. It wasn’t about debauchery.

Ryan: No, it wasn't like that.

Steak: So, I've been married twice. First one was in Montreal, which was... Do you know much about Montreal?

Ryan: Was it summer?

Steak: It was, yeah. Mid to late summer. And that's a crazy-ass town. It's kind of a filthy town. And I mean that in a nice way. Filthy, like strip clubs and stuff. But, like, beautiful town. But my first wife knew nothing about it. Like, “Montreal? that's so interesting.” I was like, “I know, isn’t it lovely? We’re going international.” But everyone else was like, “Oh, of course you’re going to Montreal. We get it.”

Ryan: Well, that's like... I had some buddies who were in a business group, and one year they decided they were going to take this international trip. The first year, they went to Cuba. And the second year, they went to Czechoslovakia. And I said, “Listen – if, in the third year, you guys go to Thailand, the jig is up. Everyone knows what you're doing.”

Steak: Yeah. Eastern European is always a creative place to decide on. “We're gonna go check out Czechoslovakia.” Right? So, my second bachelor party, I think we did because I had a bunch of clients. I think we went to Beau Rivage in Biloxi, Mississippi.

Ryan: What's that? Casinos?

Steak: Yeah, it's a casino. It's like a 40-minute...

Ryan: Outside of Memphis?

Steak: Yeah, it's near New Orleans. And I knew the owners. We did business with them when I went. So I was like, “I’ll just go to Biloxi for the weekend.” Now, there's not going to be a third one. I hope. You know Kimberly, so hopefully she's going to hang in there. But I can understand how you're not really going to do a full-fledged deal, right? Maybe we have a night out in Atlanta.

Ryan: Yeah. Well, the thing is, what people don't know is that actually, a night out in Atlanta is like a bachelor party. I mean, this town...

Steak: Dude, this town is just... you can get after it. So I'm going to tell my wife I'm going to Ryan's bachelor party.

Ryan: I was going to go to Montreal, but you ruined it for me.

Steak: Don't say you're going to go to the Dominican. Don't even try that. But I'm going to say, “I'm going to meet Ryan. It's kind of a pseudo bachelor party. We're going to Chops. It's a Thursday night.”

Ryan: No, no. We're going to go on a hunting weekend.

Steak: Oh, a hunting weekend.

Ryan: We come back to the city for dinner.

Steak: Okay. And then, I was going to say, though: “I'll see you on Sunday, though,” and she'll be like, “I thought it was one night.” I was like, “Well, the Regis is next door. And we’ve got to go.”

Ryan: I promise you, we will quit when we have to sleep.

Steak: So, are you going to be able to teach a Jewish kid from Newton, Massachusetts, who's never really held a gun, how to get after it?

Ryan: 100%.

Steak: Because you’d best have buddies like me, who just don't...

Ryan: I have California buddies who have never shot a gun.

Steak: Right. So you could help me with that. Will I have a ton of fun?

Ryan: Oh, yeah. You're going to have a smile from ear to ear. You're going to think, “Why haven't I been shooting AR-15s my whole life? Why have I not been shooting nine-millimeters? Why haven't I been shooting shotguns? This is insane. I’ve been missing out.”

Steak: Did you grow up with it?

Ryan: I grew up with all that stuff. My dad was a Special Forces Recon Marine in Vietnam.

Steak: Geez Laweez.

Ryan: And so, we had weaponry everywhere. And we grew up very comfortable with weapons. He had loaded guns all over the house.

Steak: So I grew up a Jewish kid in Boston. We had pastry everywhere where we grew up. We had bagels. We had a good nosh. Here’s something you’ve never heard out of a Jewish household: “We had weaponry everywhere.” Right? What the hell did you just say? Oh my god.

Ryan: My dad's 72. He was recently visiting us here in Georgia. And, maybe the third night, he came to me, and he said, “Do you have any extra handguns?” And I said, “Well, yeah, sure. Why?” “Because I'm having trouble sleeping.” He just wanted a handgun with them, just near him, just because it helps him sleep better.

Steak: Stop it.

Ryan: I swear. When he got back from Vietnam, for the first... I think it was 18 months, he literally slept with a loaded nine-millimeter under his pillow.

Steak: So, what's happening there? Is that the level of danger you're in over there – that you just never feel comfortable? What’s going on?

Ryan: No, it has nothing to do with it. Training with guns is no different than training in jujitsu, right? It's just something you learn. It's a skill you have.

Steak: But why can't you sleep, though?

Ryan: Well, for my dad, my dad just got so accustomed to sleeping with weapons when he was in Vietnam. And then, over the years, he just always had weapons around. And it just becomes part of what makes you comfortable. I don’t know.

Steak: So, did you ever ask him about his training as a Marine? What that was like?

Ryan: Yeah. He said back then, the training wasn't like Seal training. I mean, there was a lot of mediocre training that didn't prepare you for the stuff that you had to do. And that's why guys who had been on tours were so valuable, because that was on-the-job training.

Steak: Because they’re experienced. Is he just a badass, your dad?

Ryan: Yeah, he's a badass. I used to joke – my whole life, I've joked that... Imagine the Rock walked in right now, and my dad was here, and the Rock started to pick a fight with my dad. He's 72. He looks harmless. I would feel compelled to tell the Rock, “I know he looks like a harmless guy, but...” We want the Rock to stay alive.

Steak: So, had you ever seen him really angry, growing up, when somebody fucked with him?

Ryan: Oh, tons. My dad had a terrible temper.

Steak: Oh my god. That’s not good. So, did you get scared when you saw things happening in front of you?

Ryan: Well, he's an intimidating guy.

Steak: So, give me an example of something, growing up, where somebody just messed with them; they really didn't understand that's not where you want to go. Or your dad lost his shit.

Ryan: I saw my dad... one time, at a traffic light, some guy yells at him. My dad gets out of the car, goes over, and smashes the guy's window.

Steak: Is he still like that?

Ryan: No, he's grown up.

Steak: As a grandfather?

Ryan: He's fantastic. He's the grandpa who takes my kids out fishing. He takes my kids out and teaches them about how to clean the guns; not just, you know.

Steak: What does he say about that war?

Ryan: It was a shit war. I mean, he doesn't have a lot of positive things to say about it. I asked him one time. I said, “Hey, you want to go to Vietnam? Like, just go back and see?” He goes, “Fuck that country. I never need to see that country again.”

Steak: Just think about it. Every memory you have there is horrible.

Ryan: It’s ridiculous.

Steak: We were fighting a war. It didn't make sense. We got treated like shit when we came home. Being there was just... although, people do say it's an amazing country to visit. But I can understand why he said, “I wouldn’t want to go back there.”

Ryan: I mean, listen. He's a very, very high-functioning guy, but he has full-blown PTSD.

Steak: He does?

Ryan: He does; full-blown. There's different versions of what PTSD manifests as. He's very, very vigilant about everything.

Steak: What does that mean?

Ryan: That means he's thinking about all the details. He's thinking about all the risks. He tells stories about getting back from the war, and going to college. He'd be sitting in his classroom, and he'd find himself daydreaming. And what he was daydreaming about was how he was going to make it from this class to the next class without having too much exposure to sniper fire.

Steak: Right. So, I've heard military guys – who are fine – but they'll say, “I don't walk in a movie theater and not know all the entrances, and I'm ready for...” I don’t know. In this day and age, maybe that would help us. I'm always going to assume that somebody is going to come through that door, and I'm going to be ready to deal with that, right? Which, unfortunately, we've seen – whether it's churches or temples or movie theaters or concerts. But that's the way guys trained like that think.

Ryan: Well, and if something like that ever happened, he's the kind of guy you'd want around for that.

Steak: So, when I'm sitting in temple, in the history of incidents – particularly as it's heightened on Jewish people – and I'm there for high holy days. You're looking, and Arthur Blank is in one pew. Bernie Marcus is there, and others like that. The elite – some of the elite folks of Atlanta.

Ryan: The Jewish mafia?

Steak: Yeah. The Jewish mafia. Then you say, “Well, this would be a good target.” And we probably don't even know the level of security that exists for that.

Ryan: Arthur probably has five Mossad guys floating around.

Steak: Did you ever see the movie Munich?

Ryan: Oh, yeah.

Steak: How frigging good is that movie? Is that not an awesome movie? Anything with Mossad is fucking entertaining as hell.

Ryan: Well, the hard part about movies like that is that the underbelly of human social life is pretty dark, right?

Steak: If you're in that space.

Ryan: If you're in the space – the darkness in between the boundaries of civilization that we call espionage...

Steak: Remember the scene where they have to blow up the guy, but then his daughter’s there in the office, and he's outside? I think they do blow it up. So, it's like, “Oh, here's what's supposed to happen. Is he supposed to pick up the phone and blow it?” And he gets killed because he was tied to the terrorism in Munich.

But then, it's like, “Well, he's got a daughter, and she wasn't supposed to be there, but she's there.” And it's kind of probably what you're talking about. There's different rules. We have a mission to accomplish, and you have to get yourself in a headspace that we don't even consider.

Ryan: Well, think about all of the psychological testing they do to recruit who belongs in espionage.

Steak: That's fascinating. That's kind of like the fictional versions of the Bourne movies with Damon, and whatever. It's about who is eligible for this type of training, right? Or even the Julia Roberts...

Ryan: Who could disappear from the earth, and nobody would really notice, that we could train up?

Steak: Right. What was it, Julia Roberts? Was that Netflix, or Amazon? Her series was based on the military wiping guys’ memories when they come back, because they want to send them back out there, because they were some of their best...

Ryan: Operators.

Steak: Yeah. Anyway...

Ryan: I think it's really important to reflect on those realities, because none of our modern societies exist without those frontline people. The United States crumbles without espionage and a military. We're not sitting here on a podcast talking about food, and sports, and whatever else we want to bullshit about...

Steak: Actually having the opportunity to exist the way we do, unless there are some serious badass motherfuckers out there that allowed us this. Just like a lot of movies on the state of Israel are like, “Well, when you're surrounded on every border, 10 to 1, by your enemies, you’d better have some serious, ridiculous shit in terms of the folks that are ready to fight for you.”

Ryan: Israel only gets to continue to exist as a country because of military.

Steak: No doubt.

Ryan: So, while that is a sad commentary on humanity, it's just the truth.

Steak: And you had to get to a point where, now, folks are coming to the table with them, how many years later? They're all like, “We need be friends with them.” Because the reality is that they ain't going anywhere, right? If they thought they could wipe them out, they would have tried. They've tried, right? And now it's like, “Well, there's a thousand reasons to be friends with Israel, right?”

Ryan: There's a reason why you have to stand up and fight, because that's the only way that somebody might eventually give you respect.

Steak: Right. And they're a great example of that.

Ryan: That’s where I'm not sure where modern society... People who imagine a modern society that doesn't value and invest in a strong military – that just doesn't make any sense to me.

Steak: It's just naive. And I understand; it's a different generation. I'm not going to pooh-pooh, and I'm not coming at this... Listen, I'm more moderate than anybody. Look at where I'm from. But that's just a naive way of looking at the world. The United States of America is sitting here for a reason. It's like I tell my kids all the time about Veterans’ Day. “Do you understand that, without our World War II vets, the plan was to wipe out every Jew on the planet? Like, every Jew? If Hitler got over here... it's no different than us sitting in our homes; in our nice, cushy little homes, nine years old. You'd be taken out of the house. We'd be put on some bus or train, or somewhere. You would have been put somewhere.”

Now, yeah – that’s a dark conversation to have over a veal chop at the house. But it's like... “Understand the United States military is the reason that we...” Forget about the life we have. People are making movies now about if Hitler got over to the U.S. The plan is pretty clear. He wasn't going to stop.

Ryan: Yeah. Man in the High Castle. The Amazon show.

Steak: Have you watched it?

Ryan: It's great.

Steak: Is it? I haven’t watched it, but I’ve heard good things. And even the one that was on HBO – if, Charles Lindbergh had become president, because he was a huge anti-Semite. He wanted to work with Hitler. That was the big thing that was his undoing; when he started saying that shit. But anyway, if you don't have that military to win World War II, the plan is to kill every Jewish person on the planet – and every gay, and every... whatever it is.

Ryan: Okay. So, you have a Jewish heritage. You look back and see that your entire ethnic group would have been wiped out, culturally – right? I mean, I guess, ethnically and culturally. But did you ever learn a martial art?

Steak: No, never did. And never touched a gun.

Ryan: And you never touched a gun. Okay.

Steak: So, what does that tell you?

Ryan: Only in America.

Steak: Meaning...

Ryan: If you grew up in Israel, you would have learned.

Steak: Of course. You’re in the military.

Ryan: You would have learned Krav Maga.

Steak: Every 18-year-old – whatever you're going to do, you give your two years to the military, where you're learning all this.

Ryan: You would have learned hand-to-hand combat. You would have learned weaponry on every level, from handguns to rocket launchers. And that all would have been totally normalized, because you lived in a country that was so vulnerable, geographically.

Steak: And you owe that to your country. There's a mindset of, “We don't have our freedoms without those who came before us.” And it's not like 30% of us have to do that. 100% of us have to give their service to the military.

Ryan: But think about this. How amazing is it that, one generation removed from World War II, where Hitler was trying to wipe out an entire people group – of which you were a part... One generation later, you feel safe enough in America that you never learned a martial art and have never touched a gun. That's only because of the US military.

Steak: Do you see that and say we're soft?

Ryan: I see that, and I say that we are disrespectful of what actually makes this country great.

Steak: Of what happened before us.

Ryan: We are disrespectful of our forefathers who had the wisdom to look into the future and say, “As long as the citizens are armed, then at least there's danger for somebody who tries to suppress them.” That's good. We want that tension.

Steak: Yeah. And, listen – once again, where a moderate lands is, “Let's be careful about how easy it is to get a gun.” But I feel like most folks say the right to bear arms is not... I mean, I guess there’s a whole ‘liberal agenda,’ too, and young people who think it's crazy to have that. But most people, I would argue, are closer to the middle than you think.

I don't know. The previous administration... Trump's view on that was different from Obama's. But nobody took their guns away. And I don't think they’re going to take their guns away with Biden, either. Do you get that sense?

Ryan: I think that'd be a very...

Steak: It's a nice political thing to throw out there. Like, “We're headed to socialism,” and everything. That's the way that Republicans scare the shit out of everybody – and did a decent job. They should have won, if Trump didn't fuck it up. So, scare the shit out of people. “You're not going to have your guns, and you're going to have socialism, and college is going to be paid for completely. All those loans are going to be forgiven, when someone busted their ass to be able to do that.”

And the truth is, it'll fall – just like people who were going crazy about what Trump was going to do to our country. For the most part, politically, you could say a lot of great things happened in terms of... you know. And you could hate him. And you could say, also, you hate Obama. But the reality was, people lived a good life under Obama. They had a pretty good life under Trump. Did they not?

Ryan: Absolutely.

Steak: My rich friends, who were freaking out about Biden – they just said, “Bro, how was your life with Obama? I was still really rich. I did really well. How was it under Trump? I was a little bit richer.” I was like, “Maybe you'll be a little less rich under Biden.” But people try to scare the shit out of each other. Nobody's coming to get anybody's guns, especially down in Georgia.

Ryan: Well, I mean, the truth is, in many ways, the rich are insulated. If you become too socialist, then the rich are targets. So they're right to fear that. It's really the middle class that suffers under change. It just complicates their lives, and they really need continuity, the way that Wall Street wants continuity – because that's where their spending patterns are born. Their spending patterns are born from levels of certainty about what next year will look like.

Steak: Would you argue things are a little bit more calm, at least for right now? You see the Fox News and CNN numbers; the Fox News and CNN numbers have plummeted. CNN numbers are dead in the water. Be careful what you wish for, right?

Ryan: Yeah. I don't blame all of that on Trump. I'm not a huge Trump fan. But I think the guy gets maligned in ways that are inappropriate. I mean, we've had plenty of narcissistic presidents, right? The entire world is largely run by narcissists, sociopaths, or megalomaniacs.

Steak: I mean, why would you want to be in that seat if you weren't? But what I would say is that you don't even have to blame it on Trump. The level of vitriol... There's something simmering at all times. It was simmering at all times. Twitter would help kick it in. And the liberals were so frigging angry. And then Trump was so angry. And there was just this constant... So, if nothing else, no news out of the White House, right?

Ryan: Well, there's been a lot of executive orders.

Steak: Yes, I know. They’re doing a lot of things. But you know what I'm saying? There's just a little less simmering.

Ryan: I agree. Although, the thing that I worry about is that a lot of the simmering may have been liberal attempts to create chaos, because chaos offers opportunity for change.

Steak: Well, you certainly can look at, from the minute Trump took office... I mean, it was no free ride. There was no notion of “Let's come together.”

Ryan: The thing I get most concerned about is that I think, fundamentally, it's not that complicated to be an American. The military is essential to being American. Having freedoms is essential to being an American. We could go through a list – and probably, in less than ten items, we'd say “This is fundamentally what it means to be an American.” And if we could just get back to a place where everybody agreed on those fundamental ‘American-isms,’ then we could have all sorts of different versions of economies.

Steak: So why was it that that we all can point to friendships that absolutely ended? Absolutely. I mean, it's not like there were not right-wing Republicans and liberal Democrats on the absolute separate sides forever – to a point where, I mean... probably more on the liberal side, of “I can't look that fucking person in the eye. Did you see their post?” Or “I know they voted for him,” or “They won't stop talking about him.”

I mean, it's both sides. Although, I would just say – being a moderate, or whatever you want to call me – for liberals to say that, liberals are the ones that ended most friendships. And maybe they had a right to look with total disdain at somebody that didn't call Donald Trump out for who he is. But that whole notion of “I can't even... We've been friends for 30 years, 20 years. That's my mom and dad. I can't speak to them.” I mean, that's a fucked up way of living for the last few years.

Ryan: That is a fucked up way of living.

Steak: Right.

Ryan: But, see – that ideology; the people that are caught up in that – they believe all of the narratives. So, if you're a moderate, you don't believe the narratives. You listen to the left. “Oh, that's an interesting narrative.” You listen to the right. “Oh, that's an interesting narrative.” But you never believe any of those things with conviction.

Steak: Which is why I would argue... I mean, look. It was horrible what happened at the Capitol, but those people believed that they had a chance to do something.

Ryan: I'm not sure if they did. I mean, when I watch those videos – guys running around in buffalo hats – like, that was not well planned, if they were trying to achieve something. That felt pretty spontaneous.

Steak: No, no. But they believed that the election could be overturned.

Ryan: I think they believed that they might be able to run through the halls of the Capitol.

Steak: Oh, no. You don't think the people coming to Washington thought “This shit is real?”

Ryan: I would say that the majority of the people – not the people who actually went into the Capitol – but the majority of people who are at that rally actually believed they might be able to have enough influence in their presence; no different than anybody marching on anything. That they might have enough influence to get people to go check the voting. If they thought the voting machines were fraudulent, that they could have enough influence that people might go check them, and document that, and get it back to them.

Steak: But the data would suggest that there was no fucking chance that anything was going to get overturned. It had been in front of enough people...

Ryan: See, again; moderate. You don't believe the narratives.

Steak: Right. That’s what I’m saying. They did believe it.

Ryan: Well, the people who were doing Black Lives Matter marches – they believed the narrative. Right? They were out there in the streets.

Steak: Maybe they believed in reparation – that they could be getting hundreds and hundreds of millions of dollars.

Ryan: I think a very small percentage of the leadership are idealists. I think there's a whole bunch of people that just like doing shit. So they're like, “We're going to do what? That sounds freaky.” You know, whatever.

Steak: Well, I would say this. And I'm not saying it for everybody that lives and breathes it; every Facebook post is political. But let me tell you what I don't have time for. I’ve got three kids – 15, 13 and 9. I'm trying to build out a company that I own. I've been on the radio for 25 years. I’ve got a list that I don't get to every day. Of course, I pay attention to everything, but on the priority list of how deep I was going to get into the Senate races?

Of course, it affects what's going to happen. I just have other shit going on that was a lot more important. How's my 15-year-old doing? What kind of a father am I being? How do I try to be healthier? Those things affect my life every day. So, for folks that were... I mean, we’re talking about folks who are living and breathing every minute. Like, Fox News comes on, and I'm on there for 6.5 hours, and it's just it's seeping in. And CNN's no different. You're looking at that ticker of deaths, right? And every single time you see Donald Trump, your blood pressure is through the fucking roof. I would say to my mom... I feel like...

Ryan: “Turn off the TV.”

Steak: Yeah. But the problem is, she's not seeing her grandkids.

Ryan: Yeah, no. It’s hard.

Steak: You know what I mean?

Ryan: That’s our human interaction.

Steak: My father in law lived with us for nine months, and I finally had to say, “You can't watch Fox News. That's the rule. Like, if you want to watch it, go down to where you're staying. But I don't want to see that.”

Ryan: “Go down into your hole where they came from.”

Steak: He calls it the dungeon. It’s the nicest. I'd like to fucking live down there. Let me tell you – because he says that to bust my chops. I was like, “Bro, you’ve got a beautiful guestroom. You’ve got an awesome kitchen.” And it’s just to bust my balls. “I’m going down to the dungeon.”

Ryan: You’ve got your own entrance down there.

Steak: Yeah. You’ve got your own entrance. I mean, you could have some broad coming in, and nobody would know. The grandkids would just hear something, and wouldn’t know what it is. Anyway – like you. You’ve got a lot going on. You’re getting married, and whatnot. So here's what we know. Life is good in the country, right?

Ryan: Life is good in the country.

Steak: You're going to teach me how to shoot guns.

Ryan: 100%.

Steak: And I'm going to like it.

Ryan: You're going to love it.

Steak: We are not having a bachelor party of any significance.

Ryan: No.

Steak: But the wedding itself will be large and in charge.

Ryan: We’re going to take a cultural trip to ‘view the Canadians’ in Montreal.

Steak: Yeah; we're going to learn about other cultures. So, when do we get married?

Ryan: May 15th.

Steak: Okay. So, I hope there's going to be an invite.

Ryan: 100%. I think they go out in the next three weeks.

Steak: All right.

Ryan: I know I've been trying to wind down my list. We can sit and talk for hours like this.

Steak: Yeah. What was I supposed to talk about? Was there supposed to be anything?

Ryan: No, but we'll do another one of these – where I'll ask you more about your background, and the psychological side, which I always love.

Steak: Wasn’t there something about, like, “Steak, how did you get where you are?” I mean, something.

Ryan: I know. Of course. This was way more fun.

Steak: This is more fun, right? Is this catered, by the way?

Ryan: It is, actually. No, there's some food. If people want to find you on social media...

Steak: So, I'm @SteakShapiro. And I don't want to tell the story of how I got my name. We'll do that next time. But that is normally the first thing. “How does somebody get named ‘Steak’ that's in food and sports?”

Ryan: I thought you just had a great mother.

Steak: Yeah. Looked at me and said ‘he's like a little filet’ as he came out. @SteakShapiro, or @AtlantaEatsTV. We’re the number-one Instagram site in Atlanta for food and dining, which is no small feat. So, @AtlantaEatsTV as well.

Ryan: Steak, you're a legend. Thanks for being on the show.

Steak: That was so fun. Where do I rank? How many guests have you had on the show?

Ryan: 40? 50?

Steak: Am I top? I mean, honestly – top five percent?

Ryan: You're a 100% top-five personality. You're 100% top-five for willingness to allow the conversation to be random and diversified. Like, you're as you're as ADD as I am – which, I'll take it. I'll go with it.

Steak: So, I'm thinking about starting one of these. That's why I wanted to see.

Ryan: Oh, you’ll be amazing.

Steak: Because I love to just talk to people.

Ryan: You’re going to be the greatest. You can do it here.

Steak: You'll coach me?

Ryan: These guys will produce you.

Steak: Really? We can talk about it?

Ryan: Easy.

Steak: All right. Thanks, buddy.

Ryan: Thanks for being here.

Steak: Good to see you.

Ryan: This is Ryan Millsap, and this has been the Blackhall Studios Podcast.

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